• Re: DNS fsxNet

    From Avon@21:1/101 to tenser on Sun Feb 16 01:43:33 2020
    On 15 Feb 2020 at 04:43p, tenser pondered and said...


    Ah, very cool. I was thinking more of the SRV record stuff
    in FTS-5004 so you could get, e.g., binkd addresses and
    things like that. Using TXT and HINFO RRs in the zone
    files would also get you all sorts of interesting information.

    Is any of that data in place?

    At present no, but I would like to offer it. Sounds like there may be some script about to do this.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Netsurge on Sun Feb 16 01:52:36 2020
    On 15 Feb 2020 at 01:13a, Netsurge pondered and said...

    What do you use to create your nodelist? If you use something like
    makenl, it will do everything for you with regards to nodelist creation,

    Yep I use this :)

    Mystic processes the nodelist, but husky for example, follows the FTSC spec and won't reprocess/replace the nodelist unless the day number
    equals or matches the next release date. My Mystic setup saw him, but RNTrack and husky didn't as the nodelist you hatched out had the same
    day number.

    I've learned something today. I guess just being immersed in Mystic I forgot there's a bunch of other stuff out there that might do things different. So this has been a good learning day for me thanks :)

    One way around this, if you do use makenl, is switch it's settings to daily instead of weekly. This way, when you release a new nodelist, it will contain that days number and will be processed properly by systems who use FTSC spec nodelist processing.

    Hmm yep that could be the happy middle ground to assist all. Are there any downsides to this?

    I have a shit ton of experience with makenl which, IMO, is the best of
    the best for this. If you want, I can give you a hand scripting and setting it up so it just runs.

    Thanks Frank, appreciate the offer. If all I need to do is to change that switch then I think I may be OK. But having said that if there's other stuff
    I should be cognizant of I'm totally open to your wisdom, and thanks :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Vk3jed on Sun Feb 16 01:54:29 2020
    On 15 Feb 2020 at 05:02p, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    Did I send you the Perl script that I use? It creates the following
    from a standard nodelist:

    I think you have... I think... but it's been a while since I looked at this stuff and to be honest it's probably buried in a folder somewhere...

    Hey Siri.... google search Tony's cool Perl script....

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Atreyu@21:1/176 to Avon on Sat Feb 15 08:45:56 2020
    On 15 Feb 20 20:52:36, Avon said the following to Netsurge:

    One way around this, if you do use makenl, is switch it's settings to daily instead of weekly. This way, when you release a new nodelist, it will contain that days number and will be processed properly by systems who use FTSC spec nodelist processing.

    Hmm yep that could be the happy middle ground to assist all. Are there any downsides to this?

    Just to chime in on this from my experience - Daily MakeNL nodelists solve two problems. First it eliminates a bit of complexity with maintaining traditional list+differentials and the second is that any changes are obviously "daily".

    A newly listed system does not need to wait until next week to be nodelisted and any tech problems with a listing can corrected "daily".

    Atreyu

    --- Renegade vY2Ka2
    * Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (21:1/176)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Atreyu on Sun Feb 16 03:11:28 2020
    On 15 Feb 2020 at 03:45a, Atreyu pondered and said...

    Just to chime in on this from my experience - Daily MakeNL nodelists
    solve two problems. First it eliminates a bit of complexity with maintaining traditional list+differentials and the second is that any changes are obviously "daily".

    Thanks for doing so :) I'm very open to guidance.

    So would it become that I hatched daily nodelists or are we saying we run MakeNL in a fashion whereby it creates a format of the nodelist that can be zipped but when processed by systems is accepted as the correct version as of that day vs a Friday only one?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Atreyu on Sun Feb 16 03:14:04 2020
    On 15 Feb 2020 at 10:11p, Avon pondered and said...

    Thanks for doing so :) I'm very open to guidance.

    So would it become that I hatched daily nodelists or are we saying we run MakeNL in a fashion whereby it creates a format of the nodelist that can be zipped but when processed by systems is accepted as the correct
    version as of that day vs a Friday only one?

    I should clarify, is there an option to process as daily but still hatch as weekly? Or am I down the path of just changing a setting in MakeNL and then sending out daily nodelists that are/are not compressed? I'm a tad confused.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Sun Feb 16 01:36:00 2020
    On 02-15-20 20:54, Avon wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    On 15 Feb 2020 at 05:02p, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    Did I send you the Perl script that I use? It creates the following
    from a standard nodelist:

    I think you have... I think... but it's been a while since I looked at this stuff and to be honest it's probably buried in a folder
    somewhere...

    Hey Siri.... google search Tony's cool Perl script....

    Haha you've been sitting on it for ages. :D


    ... there can only be one way of life, and it works :)
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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Sun Feb 16 01:50:00 2020
    On 02-15-20 22:14, Avon wrote to Atreyu <=-

    I should clarify, is there an option to process as daily but still
    hatch as weekly? Or am I down the path of just changing a setting in MakeNL and then sending out daily nodelists that are/are not
    compressed? I'm a tad confused.

    I can't see why you can't have a cron job/event that runs once a week, but have the nodelist processing configuration such that it _could_ be run on another day.


    ... ADVENTURE: The land between entertainment and panic.
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  • From Netsurge@21:4/154 to Avon on Sat Feb 15 17:21:54 2020
    Hmm yep that could be the happy middle ground to assist all. Are there
    any downsides to this?

    Not really, The only thing you need to be cognoscente of is using the replace switch when you hatch out. Hatching nodelists that end in a number that is a multiple of 7, the likelihood of hatching a nodelist two years in a row with the same extension is slim. When you switch to daily and hatch out a nodelist that conceivably could have any day number increases the chance of having a nodelist with two of the same extensions year after year.

    Thanks Frank, appreciate the offer. If all I need to do is to change that switch then I think I may be OK. But having said that if there's other stuff I should be cognizant of I'm totally open to your wisdom, and

    If you are open to maximum compatibility then maybe offering alternate compressors like lha for Amiga users, but I'm not familiar with how many
    Amiga systems are in fsxNet or how many of them actually care about the nodelist. Either way it would just be a plus, not a necessity. I have the proper commandline entry for arc, lha, etc.. if you want.

    |15frank |08// |15netsurge
    |07disksh0p|08!|07bbs |08% |07bbs.diskshop.ca |08% |07mystic goodness |11SciNet |03ftn hq |08% |07https://scinet-ftn.org

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/12 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: % disksh0p!bbs % bbs.diskshop.ca % SciNet ftn hq % (21:4/154)
  • From Netsurge@21:4/154 to Avon on Sat Feb 15 17:23:56 2020
    So would it become that I hatched daily nodelists or are we saying we run MakeNL in a fashion whereby it creates a format of the nodelist that can be zipped but when processed by systems is accepted as the correct
    version as of that day vs a Friday only one?

    Yup. Most nodelist processors use the header of the nodelist, which lists
    what day the nodelist is for to determine if this nodelist is newer than what it currently has.

    |15frank |08// |15netsurge
    |07disksh0p|08!|07bbs |08% |07bbs.diskshop.ca |08% |07mystic goodness |11SciNet |03ftn hq |08% |07https://scinet-ftn.org

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/12 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: % disksh0p!bbs % bbs.diskshop.ca % SciNet ftn hq % (21:4/154)
  • From Netsurge@21:4/154 to Avon on Sat Feb 15 17:24:46 2020
    I should clarify, is there an option to process as daily but still hatch as weekly? Or am I down the path of just changing a setting in MakeNL
    and then sending out daily nodelists that are/are not compressed? I'm a tad confused.

    You can do both if you wish using two .ctl files, but if you are doing it
    daily then there is no need to also do it weekly.

    |15frank |08// |15netsurge
    |07disksh0p|08!|07bbs |08% |07bbs.diskshop.ca |08% |07mystic goodness |11SciNet |03ftn hq |08% |07https://scinet-ftn.org

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/12 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: % disksh0p!bbs % bbs.diskshop.ca % SciNet ftn hq % (21:4/154)
  • From Embalmed@21:4/166 to Avon on Sat Feb 15 21:25:19 2020
    So would it become that I hatched daily nodelists or are we saying we run MakeNL in a fashion whereby it creates a format of the nodelist that can be zipped but when processed by systems is accepted as the correct
    version as of that day vs a Friday only one?

    Either, but I think if you can make the whole thing automatic like v???
    (sorry can't remember the handle atm) suggested via crontab you can remove one more thing you have to deal with and solve the issue at the same time.

    |07E|10m|07b|10a|07l|10m|07e|10d |12-----------------------------------------------------
    |09Black Lodge Research BBS |11blacklodgeresearch.org:4022
    |08fsxNet: 21:4/166

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: Black Lodge Research BBS (21:4/166)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Embalmed on Sun Feb 16 18:43:25 2020
    On 15 Feb 2020 at 04:25p, Embalmed pondered and said...

    Either, but I think if you can make the whole thing automatic like v??? (sorry can't remember the handle atm) suggested via crontab you can
    remove one more thing you have to deal with and solve the issue at the same time.

    Yep it's automated to hatch weekly but I force hatches when I add nodes, but the current leaning will be towards daily hatching in a way that all systems can accept them. Will work with Netsurge on this over the coming days :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Embalmed on Mon Feb 17 01:57:00 2020
    On 02-15-20 16:25, Embalmed wrote to Avon <=-

    So would it become that I hatched daily nodelists or are we saying we run MakeNL in a fashion whereby it creates a format of the nodelist that can be zipped but when processed by systems is accepted as the correct
    version as of that day vs a Friday only one?

    Either, but I think if you can make the whole thing automatic like v??? (sorry can't remember the handle atm) suggested via crontab you can
    remove one more thing you have to deal with and solve the issue at the same time.

    That would be me. All I have to think about with my nodelist processing is to ensure that the data is up to date, and the automatic processing does the rest. :)


    ... An honest politician is one who, when bought, stays bought.
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  • From Embalmed@21:4/166 to Vk3jed on Sun Feb 16 08:13:39 2020
    That would be me. All I have to think about with my nodelist processing is to ensure that the data is up to date, and the automatic processing does the rest. :)

    Sorry I was going to attempt it but knew I would butcher the name ;)
    Sounds nice!

    |07E|10m|07b|10a|07l|10m|07e|10d |12-----------------------------------------------------
    |09Black Lodge Research BBS |11blacklodgeresearch.org:4022
    |11fsx|08Net: |0721:4/166 |11sci|08Net: |0777:1/133

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: Black Lodge Research BBS (21:4/166)
  • From Atreyu@21:1/176 to Avon on Sun Feb 16 20:12:28 2020
    On 15 Feb 20 22:11:28, Avon said the following to Atreyu:

    So would it become that I hatched daily nodelists or are we saying we run MakeNL in a fashion whereby it creates a format of the nodelist that can be zipped but when processed by systems is accepted as the correct version as o that day vs a Friday only one?

    You can do both. Keep the current filename and weekly production of the Fsxnet nodelist as-is so Sysops used to the current hatching don't need to change anything. Make up a different nodelist filename for the Daily, ie. FSXDAILY and promote it accordingly; Sysops will eventually switch and enjoy the benefits I pointed out earlier.

    Thats what I did in Fidonet. The traditional Nodelist/Nodediff all stayed the same while I was free to make up whatver I wanted for the Daily. I worked with the ZC2 so each of us had unique filenames for our respective Zones. Z1DAILY and Z2DAILY. I'm not sure what ZC3 does but probably something simular.

    Fun fact, the reason why Fidonet has seperate nodelist generation per zone and not one centrally-pubished nodelist dates back to the 80's and the days of
    IBM XT's and MFM hard drives. Compiling/indexing the nodelist was painfully slow and disk-space very limited. When a Zone placed their segment first before other zones, indexing was faster and mailers had the option of
    dropping the other Zone segments if they were not required.

    Long distance was also a factor... this also explained the rise of Zonegates.

    Atreyu

    --- Renegade vY2Ka2
    * Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (21:1/176)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Atreyu on Tue Feb 18 02:30:35 2020
    On 16 Feb 2020 at 03:12p, Atreyu pondered and said...

    You can do both. Keep the current filename and weekly production of the Fsxnet nodelist as-is so Sysops used to the current hatching don't need
    to change anything. Make up a different nodelist filename for the Daily, ie. FSXDAILY and promote it accordingly; Sysops will eventually switch
    and enjoy the benefits I pointed out earlier.

    Thanks for the idea / advice :)

    I'm not sure I want to create a different nodelist name. I was hoping I might be able to hatch a daily nodelist using the same name as the weekly one.

    I'll keep pondering.

    Fun fact, the reason why Fidonet has seperate nodelist generation per
    zone and not one centrally-pubished nodelist dates back to the 80's and the days of IBM XT's and MFM hard drives. Compiling/indexing the
    nodelist was painfully slow and disk-space very limited. When a Zone placed their segment first before other zones, indexing was faster and mailers had the option of dropping the other Zone segments if they were not required.

    Yikes :) The joys of early tech. When I think back to how much money I spent
    on 14.4k modems, then 28.8k, 33.6k etc.. and the 20 megabyte HDD - I might start to cry a little :)

    Long distance was also a factor... this also explained the rise of Zonegates.

    :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Embalmed on Tue Feb 18 00:17:00 2020
    On 02-16-20 03:13, Embalmed wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    That would be me. All I have to think about with my nodelist processing is to ensure that the data is up to date, and the automatic processing does the rest. :)

    Sorry I was going to attempt it but knew I would butcher the name ;) Sounds nice!

    Yeah, found it with Google, just had to modify it to suit a non Fidonet FTN. Only significant limitation of the script I have is that it doesn't handle literal IPv6 addresses in the nodelist, but it will create A records for BBSs with literal IPv4 addresses in their nodelist entries and CNAME records for BBSs with a hostname. Are there any literal IPv6 addresses in the Fidonet nodelist?


    ... (A)bort, (R)etry, (P)retend this never happened...
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    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Bucko@21:4/131 to Avon on Tue Feb 18 01:00:28 2020
    On 17 Feb 2020, Avon said the following...


    Yikes :) The joys of early tech. When I think back to how much money I spent on 14.4k modems, then 28.8k, 33.6k etc.. and the 20 megabyte HDD -
    I might start to cry a little :)


    You want to cry like me? I was a Commodore User/SysOp, My first 1200baud Commodore modem cost me $169, I got my second same modem from Qlink for $69,
    my first 2400 Supra modem $179, first 14.4 Supra $229, First 28.8,33.6 $229. First 20meg HD Lt Kernal $1000. In 2015 I decided while moving I was never going to use any of that stuff again, why should I pack it all away to take
    up space in the new place?!?! I gave it all away to a guy who lived near by.
    If I added up everything that I gave him what it cost me would be in the $3k
    to $4k range. I threw away a USR v.Everything modem in 2017 because why would
    I need a modem I have cable internet?!?!? 1 year later the BBS bug bit me again, no thanks to your videos! I put up a Mystic, then a SynchroNet and wanted a dialup node, what no modem! Buy a USR 56k USB for $15 on eBay,
    doesn't work with Win 10, buy another USR 56k works fine doesn't work with a VOIP line! Decide to put up a Amiga BBS don't have any of my Amiga stuff anymore (gave it all away), get talked into programming Image BBS for the C64 again, don't have any of my hardware (gave it all away)!! I have replaced all of the Commodore stuff, with the exception of the AMiga stuff, and for what I could have paid for a Rack Server on eBay, I now have 5 PC's doing, Amiga, Commodore, Windows, and A mish mash of it all! LOL I have been crying since
    May 1st of 2018 when I saw a video by Paul Hayton on how to setup Mystic
    BBS!!! LOL THANKS AVON!!!

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (21:4/131)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Netsurge on Thu Feb 20 02:32:52 2020
    On 18 Feb 2020 at 09:54p, Netsurge pondered and said...

    Can you guide me please as to what I should add?

    Do you want me to send you the perl script I use for SciNet? It does everything for you and creates a bind9 compatible hosts conf file.

    Yes please, that would be appreciated thank you :)

    If you want an example, use https://mxtoolbox.com/SRVLookup.aspx and lookup your node in SciNet's SRV record for binkp as you use 24555. It is _binkp._tcp.f102.n3.z77.scinet-ftn.org

    Will test this out.

    I can also publish the DNS for you if you wish. I have a cluster of DNS servers and have the infrastructure all setup here and already get a
    copy of the fsxnet nodelist since I am a member of fsxnet. It would be just one more script I run and no big deal. You would just have to point the domain you want to use to my dns servers.

    I have a DNS server running here for fsxnet.nz and Vorlon also gets a copy of the DNS records and is listed as another name server. Would you be happy to receive copies of a zone file and act as another name server?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/16 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to tenser on Thu Feb 20 02:38:11 2020
    On 19 Feb 2020 at 04:16p, tenser pondered and said...

    The issue in this case is that you shouldn't add SRV
    RR's for a hostname that is an alias (e.g., a CNAME).


    Forgive me I'm still learning all things DNS, so some of this is not clear to me as I have not used some of the zone records to know them well.

    Another workaround might be to have a dedicated
    "nodelist" domain; suppose one ponies up the 20
    euros a year for a Dutch domain like `fsxnet.nl`;
    then that domain might consist only of SRV
    records pointing to actual host names (not CNAMEs).
    People who want port information do SRV queries
    against that domain; if you just want to connect,
    you do a query against the domain in fsxnet.org.

    Well I own fsxnet.nz and set up my own Bind server as ns1.fsxnet.nz that
    offers results for DNS queries... this is also mirrored to ns2.fsxnet.nz
    kindly run by Vorlon.

    So with that said perhaps I can do some of what you suggest, so long as I understand just what it is I am to do :) Ha!

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/16 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Vorlon@21:1/195 to Avon on Thu Feb 20 04:29:03 2020

    Hello Avon!

    19 Feb 20 21:32, you wrote to Netsurge:

    I have a DNS server running here for fsxnet.nz and Vorlon also gets a
    copy of the DNS records and is listed as another name server. Would
    you be happy to receive copies of a zone file and act as another name server?

    The min number of name servers is 2, with more being an advantage.

    All you have to do is the same as what's done with ns2, except use netsurge's IP address.




    Vorlon


    --- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20170303
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair ---:- dragon.vk3heg.net -:--- (21:1/195)
  • From Netsurge@21:4/154 to Avon on Wed Feb 19 13:57:54 2020

    I have a DNS server running here for fsxnet.nz and Vorlon also gets a
    copy of the DNS records and is listed as another name server. Would you
    be happy to receive copies of a zone file and act as another name server?

    If you need a tertiary dns server I would be glad to offer you up space.

    |15frank |08// |15netsurge
    |07disksh0p|08!|07bbs |08% |07bbs.diskshop.ca |08% |07mystic goodness |11SciNet |03ftn hq |08% |07https://scinet-ftn.org

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/12 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: % disksh0p!bbs % bbs.diskshop.ca % SciNet ftn hq % (21:4/154)
  • From tenser@21:1/101 to Avon on Thu Feb 20 08:41:54 2020
    On 19 Feb 2020 at 09:38p, Avon pondered and said...

    On 19 Feb 2020 at 04:16p, tenser pondered and said...

    The issue in this case is that you shouldn't add SRV
    RR's for a hostname that is an alias (e.g., a CNAME).

    Forgive me I'm still learning all things DNS, so some of this is not
    clear to me as I have not used some of the zone records to know them
    well.

    Please don't apologize! There is some stuff in
    there that is both subtle and arcane. In
    particular, CNAMEs are sort of weird, in that
    you can have a CNAME in some domain pointing to
    some other domain name, but you can't have many
    other records associated with the CNAME (the
    exceptions are mostly related to DNSSEC, or DNS
    security extensions).

    The rationale behind this restriction has to do
    with data consistency across the DNS. Suppose
    some hostname, `foo.com` has SRV records for
    some set of services. Now suppose there's a
    CNAME in domain `bar.com` pointing to `foo.com`:

    foo in cname foo.com

    So that `foo.bar.com` aliases `foo.com`. Now
    suppose the DNS allowed you to attach SRV records
    _to the CNAME_: what's to say that the records
    on the CNAME are consistent with the records on
    the actual domain? What if the records on
    `foo.com` change over time; what keeps the records
    on the CNAME in sync? If they differ, which takes
    precedence? It quickly becomes a mess.

    So the designers of DNS chose, instead, to bypass
    the entire problem by mandating that you couldn't
    attach such records to a DNS alias. It's a
    pragmatic decision that sidesteps lots of consistency
    problems.

    If one reads FTS-5004 carefully, one will notice
    that for hosts that require SRV records for e.g.
    non-standard port numbers, those entries have A
    and AAAA records and no CNAMEs, while those that
    use standard ports and don't need SRV records just
    have CNAMEs. Of course, the problem with THAT is
    that now you've got different IP addresses listed
    in different domains, and one is under control
    (presumably) two different parties: there's nothing
    technically keeping them in sync anymore. If one
    wants to move one's system from e.g. one's home
    network to a cloud provider with an IP address
    change, then you've got to update your local
    domain _and_ the nodelist domain. That sounds
    painful.

    Well, a technical solution might be for the
    nodelist->zone generation software to run as a
    daemon and do continual zone updates. You could
    do something like query each node in the list
    and generate A and AAAA records in the nodelist
    zone for that host, but keep track of the record
    TTLs and, once they expire, query again and
    update the zone if the IP address changed. That
    would be robust against the sorts of consistency
    issues mentioned above in the sense that latency
    of nodelist domain changes would be more or less
    that of cached result expiration from the source
    domain, which an IP address change would have to
    suffer through anyway, but it would be rather
    more involved than just a simple script that read
    and parsed one text file and generated another.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Oli@21:1/151 to tenser on Wed Feb 19 23:03:40 2020
    19 Feb 20 11:21, you wrote to me:

    On 18 Feb 2020 at 05:45p, Oli pondered and said...

    Paul, have you given any thought to doing DNS distribution
    for nodelist data, a la http://ftsc.org/docs/fts-5004.001 ?}
    I'd kind of like to play around with that.


    IMHO that specification and most implementations are broken by design.
    The problem are SRV
    records, non-standard ports and different hostnames for different
    protocols.

    You'll get no argument from me that most of the FTSC
    standards are broken, or at a minimum poorly specified.

    That said, I'm not sure I follow your argument: could
    you expand on it a bit? If one is going to use
    non-standard ports (and there are actually some decent
    reasons for that), then SRV records seem OK to me.

    Before I elaborate on it I need to make some more tests. For some reason I cannot get binkd to
    lookup SRV records at all.

    Binkd 1.1a-101 (Jan 31 2020 18:04:39/Linux)
    Compilation flags: gcc, zlib, bzlib2, perl, https, amiga_4d_outbound. Facilities: fts5004 ipv6


    --- CENSORED v0.00 ABC
    * Origin: 🦄 🌈 (21:1/151)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Thu Feb 20 16:41:00 2020
    On 02-19-20 21:32, Avon wrote to Netsurge <=-

    I have a DNS server running here for fsxnet.nz and Vorlon also gets a
    copy of the DNS records and is listed as another name server. Would you
    be happy to receive copies of a zone file and act as another name
    server?

    Hmm, maybe we can all help each other out here with name servers, and I can also make my third party slave available. :)


    ... What a man needs in gardening is a cast iron back with a hinge in it.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to tenser on Thu Feb 20 17:19:00 2020
    On 02-20-20 03:41, tenser wrote to Avon <=-

    So the designers of DNS chose, instead, to bypass
    the entire problem by mandating that you couldn't
    attach such records to a DNS alias. It's a
    pragmatic decision that sidesteps lots of consistency
    problems.

    I remember similar issues with MX records, and pointing an MX record to a CNAME was/is a no no.

    If one reads FTS-5004 carefully, one will notice
    that for hosts that require SRV records for e.g.
    non-standard port numbers, those entries have A
    and AAAA records and no CNAMEs, while those that
    use standard ports and don't need SRV records just
    have CNAMEs. Of course, the problem with THAT is
    that now you've got different IP addresses listed
    in different domains, and one is under control
    (presumably) two different parties: there's nothing
    technically keeping them in sync anymore. If one
    wants to move one's system from e.g. one's home
    network to a cloud provider with an IP address
    change, then you've got to update your local
    domain _and_ the nodelist domain. That sounds
    painful.

    If the IPs are static, that's not an issue, you can do a lookup when you update the nodelist and DNS, or if the IP is already a literal in the nodelist, simply take the IP from the nodelist everytime you do an update. The real problem is where you have a BBS that uses a DDNS service for a static hostname on a connection with a dynamic IP. In this situation, the IP could change at any time, and there is no way of knowing when, short of repeatedly querying DNS from a cron job (which is not a great thing to do ;) ).

    Well, a technical solution might be for the
    nodelist->zone generation software to run as a
    daemon and do continual zone updates. You could
    do something like query each node in the list
    and generate A and AAAA records in the nodelist
    zone for that host, but keep track of the record
    TTLs and, once they expire, query again and
    update the zone if the IP address changed. That

    Gets ugly when TTL is 60 seconds (common for DDNS services). ;)

    would be robust against the sorts of consistency
    issues mentioned above in the sense that latency
    of nodelist domain changes would be more or less
    that of cached result expiration from the source
    domain, which an IP address change would have to
    suffer through anyway, but it would be rather
    more involved than just a simple script that read
    and parsed one text file and generated another.

    Yeah. I think the designers of the script I wrote decided to avoid the issue altogether, and don't include any other RRs when a SRV is required.


    ... Quiet, don't type so hard, I've got a headache!
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From tenser@21:1/101 to Vk3jed on Thu Feb 20 20:18:39 2020
    On 20 Feb 2020 at 12:19p, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    On 02-20-20 03:41, tenser wrote to Avon <=-

    So the designers of DNS chose, instead, to bypass
    the entire problem by mandating that you couldn't
    attach such records to a DNS alias. It's a
    pragmatic decision that sidesteps lots of consistency
    problems.

    I remember similar issues with MX records, and pointing an MX record to
    a CNAME was/is a no no.

    Correct. The only other RRs you are permitted to
    attach to a CNAME are all related to DNSSEC.

    Well, a technical solution might be for the
    nodelist->zone generation software to run as a
    daemon and do continual zone updates. You could
    do something like query each node in the list
    and generate A and AAAA records in the nodelist
    zone for that host, but keep track of the record
    TTLs and, once they expire, query again and
    update the zone if the IP address changed. That

    Gets ugly when TTL is 60 seconds (common for DDNS services). ;)

    I actually don't think it would be that bad. That probably
    amounts to a handful of domains per minute.

    Another option, though really rather more involved, is to
    write a special authoritative DNS server for the nodelist
    domain. It can maintain the IP address information for
    the nodelist domain and synthesize RRs on the fly, lazily
    fetching the results from queries on the underlying domain
    and its own cache of those responses and their expiration
    times. Then the frequency of lookups is on the order of
    the number of times a particular node is queried, modulo
    the target node's TTL.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to tenser on Thu Feb 20 20:30:00 2020
    On 02-20-20 15:18, tenser wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I remember similar issues with MX records, and pointing an MX record to
    a CNAME was/is a no no.

    Correct. The only other RRs you are permitted to
    attach to a CNAME are all related to DNSSEC.

    That makes sense.

    Gets ugly when TTL is 60 seconds (common for DDNS services). ;)

    I actually don't think it would be that bad. That probably
    amounts to a handful of domains per minute.

    Will be interesting to see. Might be a worthwhile experiment. Have to work out the best way to make the changes. Probably the DDNS hooks in BIND9 maybe (I have used BIND9 dynamic updates in the past, pretty cool when limited to localhost or the LAN and properly locked down), so I can manipulate the required RRs directly? Run one pass after the weekly nodelist update to update all A and AAAA RRS associated with nodelist entries that have a hostname and port, then update from there according to TTL perhaps? One advantage is that RRs with a TTL longer than a week won't generate more than one DNS query per week.

    Another option, though really rather more involved, is to
    write a special authoritative DNS server for the nodelist
    domain. It can maintain the IP address information for
    the nodelist domain and synthesize RRs on the fly, lazily
    fetching the results from queries on the underlying domain
    and its own cache of those responses and their expiration
    times. Then the frequency of lookups is on the order of
    the number of times a particular node is queried, modulo
    the target node's TTL.

    Interesting idea, not something I could do though.


    ... Do you want graphics? NO, and quit asking me!
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Vk3jed on Thu Feb 20 23:42:50 2020
    On 20 Feb 2020 at 11:41a, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    Hmm, maybe we can all help each other out here with name servers, and I can also make my third party slave available. :)

    If I can suss how to, I'd be happy to support you both...

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Oli@21:1/151 to Vk3jed on Thu Feb 20 13:39:56 2020
    20 Feb 20 12:19, you wrote to tenser:

    On 02-20-20 03:41, tenser wrote to Avon <=-

    So the designers of DNS chose, instead, to bypass
    the entire problem by mandating that you couldn't
    attach such records to a DNS alias. It's a
    pragmatic decision that sidesteps lots of consistency
    problems.

    I remember similar issues with MX records, and pointing an MX record to a
    CNAME
    was/is a no no.

    My biggest mistake (a long time ago) was using a CNAME on the naked domain ...

    --- CENSORED v0.00 ABC
    * Origin: 🦄 🌈 (21:1/151)
  • From Oli@21:1/151 to tenser on Thu Feb 20 13:43:00 2020

    Another option, though really rather more involved, is to
    write a special authoritative DNS server for the nodelist
    domain. It can maintain the IP address information for
    the nodelist domain and synthesize RRs on the fly, lazily
    fetching the results from queries on the underlying domain
    and its own cache of those responses and their expiration
    times. Then the frequency of lookups is on the order of
    the number of times a particular node is queried, modulo
    the target node's TTL.

    That's the only reliable option. It could also query SRV records on the hostname in the nodelist (the uderlying domain). But then we
    still would run into problem if people will start using TLS and check for the validity of the cert.

    Nodelist distribution over DNS is also not very decentralized anymore, but a single point of failure. Btw, do you know how (or
    if) the option can be disabled for binkp at compilation? I find it more annoying than helpful.

    --- CENSORED v0.00 ABC
    * Origin: 🦄 🌈 (21:1/151)
  • From tenser@21:1/101 to Oli on Fri Feb 21 06:44:07 2020
    On 20 Feb 2020 at 08:43a, Oli pondered and said...

    Another option, though really rather more involved, is to
    write a special authoritative DNS server for the nodelist
    domain. It can maintain the IP address information for
    the nodelist domain and synthesize RRs on the fly, lazily
    fetching the results from queries on the underlying domain
    and its own cache of those responses and their expiration
    times. Then the frequency of lookups is on the order of
    the number of times a particular node is queried, modulo
    the target node's TTL.

    That's the only reliable option. It could also query SRV records on the hostname in the nodelist (the uderlying domain).

    Indeed.

    But then we
    still would run into problem if people will start using TLS and check
    for the validity of the cert.

    Do you mean of the target service, like an HTTP
    server or something on the target host being tied
    to a particular hostname?

    Nodelist distribution over DNS is also not very decentralized anymore,
    but a single point of failure.

    It doesn't need to be any more centralized than
    any other set of DNS servers for a domain. You
    could have multiple such servers consuming the
    same underlying data as authoritative nameservers
    for the nodelist domain.

    Btw, do you know how (or
    if) the option can be disabled for binkp at compilation? I find it more annoying than helpful.

    I'm afraid I don't. The more I use it, the more
    I distrust `binkd`. On the Fat Dragon, I've
    replaced it with a binkd server I wrote, though
    that's still not quite ready for prime time. At
    least I'm getting mail and the server no longer
    crashes, though.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Netsurge on Thu Feb 20 11:52:00 2020
    Netsurge wrote to Avon <=-

    If you need a tertiary dns server I would be glad to offer you up
    space.

    This makes me nostalgic for a kindler, gentler time when everyone ran their own boxes from home and everyone was secondary/tertiary MX and DNS for each other.

    I had more time on my hands back then. I had my choice of maintaning a home lab or having a house, wife and kids... :)



    ... Cut a vital connection
    --- MultiMail/XT v0.52
    * Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org (21:4/122)
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Avon on Thu Feb 20 11:55:00 2020
    Avon wrote to tenser <=-

    Forgive me I'm still learning all things DNS, so some of this is not
    clear to me as I have not used some of the zone records to know them
    well.

    My first experience with DNS was having the university that had loaned us
    a SUN workstation to host DNS needing it back.

    I picked up the O'Reilly book "DNS and BIND" by Cricket Liu, came in to work on a Saturday morning, and brought up a BSD box on a PC, then read the book from cover to cover. By noon, we had a responding DNS server.

    Great book, I thoroughly recommend it to anyone wanting to run DNS.


    ... Consider transitions
    --- MultiMail/XT v0.52
    * Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org (21:4/122)
  • From Joacim Melin@21:2/130 to Avon on Thu Feb 20 23:17:53 2020
    Let me know if you need more mirrors here in Sweden. I have three public DNS servers.


    --- NiKom v2.5.0
    * Origin: Delta City (deltacity.se, Vallentuna, Sweden) (21:2/130.0)
  • From tenser@21:1/101 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Feb 21 17:01:03 2020
    On 20 Feb 2020 at 06:55a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    I picked up the O'Reilly book "DNS and BIND" by Cricket Liu, came in to work on a Saturday morning, and brought up a BSD box on a PC, then read the book from cover to cover. By noon, we had a responding DNS server.

    I remember that book. For that matter, I remember
    BIND version 4. Ah, the halcyon days of my youth....
    Things were so much simpler then.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Feb 21 17:30:15 2020
    On 20 Feb 2020 at 06:55a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    Great book, I thoroughly recommend it to anyone wanting to run DNS.

    Thanks for the reference... most of my Bind 101 has been some how-to
    references I found online and a lot of trial and error. The learn by doing adage is one I strongly subscribe to :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Joacim Melin on Fri Feb 21 17:32:55 2020

    On 20 Feb 2020 at 06:17p, Joacim Melin pondered and said...

    Let me know if you need more mirrors here in Sweden. I have three public DNS servers.

    cool thank you for the offer also.. when I get time to focus on this stuff I will certainly take the offers of help up. I just need to look back where I configured things in Bind... etc.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Sat Feb 22 00:40:00 2020
    On 02-20-20 18:42, Avon wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    On 20 Feb 2020 at 11:41a, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    Hmm, maybe we can all help each other out here with name servers, and I can also make my third party slave available. :)

    If I can suss how to, I'd be happy to support you both...

    Pretty straightforward. I just have to get the details handy. :)


    ... Hmmm ... isn't BBSing just full of surprises?
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Oli on Sat Feb 22 00:43:00 2020
    On 02-20-20 08:39, Oli wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    My biggest mistake (a long time ago) was using a CNAME on the naked
    domain ...

    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?


    ... A fast has no real nutritional value.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Feb 22 01:02:00 2020
    On 02-20-20 06:55, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Avon <=-

    I picked up the O'Reilly book "DNS and BIND" by Cricket Liu, came in to work on a Saturday morning, and brought up a BSD box on a PC, then read the book from cover to cover. By noon, we had a responding DNS server.

    Great book, I thoroughly recommend it to anyone wanting to run DNS.

    Yes, that's an excellent reference. I found it invaluable when I was running DNS for a company. I've still got it, but need to update my copy, as it dates back to the BIND8 days. :/


    ... I AM IMMORTAL! Well, so far anyway...
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to tenser on Sat Feb 22 01:05:00 2020
    On 02-21-20 12:01, tenser wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    On 20 Feb 2020 at 06:55a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    I picked up the O'Reilly book "DNS and BIND" by Cricket Liu, came in to work on a Saturday morning, and brought up a BSD box on a PC, then read the book from cover to cover. By noon, we had a responding DNS server.

    I remember that book. For that matter, I remember
    BIND version 4. Ah, the halcyon days of my youth....
    Things were so much simpler then.

    I started on BIND4 myself, and later went to BIND9. :)


    ... He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to tenser on Fri Feb 21 12:07:00 2020
    tenser wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I remember that book. For that matter, I remember
    BIND version 4. Ah, the halcyon days of my youth....
    Things were so much simpler then.

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP servers as
    a courtesy.


    ... "We can't stop here, this is bat country."
    --- MultiMail/XT v0.52
    * Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org (21:4/122)
  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Fri Feb 21 13:44:06 2020
    My biggest mistake (a long time ago) was using a CNAME on the naked domain ...
    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?

    Turn away...unless you are ready for something no one should see. ;)

    Am in a decent mood right now...so I had to take it. ;)

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: ACME BBS-I taut I taw a puddy tat! (21:2/147)
  • From tenser@21:1/101 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Feb 22 11:01:09 2020
    On 21 Feb 2020 at 07:07a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    tenser wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I remember that book. For that matter, I remember
    BIND version 4. Ah, the halcyon days of my youth....
    Things were so much simpler then.

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP servers as a courtesy.

    Those were the days. (Cue the theme from "Archie Bunker")

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Feb 22 11:14:41 2020
    On 21 Feb 2020 at 07:07a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP servers as a courtesy.

    I hope the date goes well... oh wait a minute :)

    Joking aside I think it's neat that we have such a nice mix of age and experience with respect to the early and later Internet eras along with those of us old enough to remember dial up times, the hey day of BBS and earlier still.

    I always enjoy your thoughtful posts. Thanks for writing/sharing them :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Oli@21:1/151 to Vk3jed on Fri Feb 21 23:15:47 2020
    21 Feb 20 19:43, you wrote to me:

    On 02-20-20 08:39, Oli wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    My biggest mistake (a long time ago) was using a CNAME on the naked
    domain ...

    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?

    something like

    example.com CNAME example.gitlab.io

    A good explanation why this doesn't work: https://www.isc.org/blogs/cname-at-the-apex-of-a-zone/


    --- CENSORED v0.00 ABC
    * Origin: 🦄 🌈 (21:1/151)
  • From ryan@21:1/168 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Feb 21 18:41:19 2020
    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP servers as a courtesy.

    I'm pretty fussy and don't think I could put up with dating myself, which is why I just have a series of one night stands with myself

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: monterey bbs (21:1/168)
  • From Atreyu@21:1/176 to Ryan on Fri Feb 21 22:25:04 2020
    On 21 Feb 20 13:41:19, Ryan said the following to Poindexter Fortran:

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP server as a courtesy.

    I'm pretty fussy and don't think I could put up with dating myself, which is why I just have a series of one night stands with myself

    I carry a picture of my right hand in my wallet.

    I have to hide it from the left hand; there are some serious jealousy issues.

    Especially when I spend my time testing Mystic 10 This is What it Sounds Like When Doves Cry edition.

    Atreyu

    --- Renegade vY2Ka2
    * Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (21:1/176)
  • From ryan@21:1/168 to Atreyu on Sat Feb 22 00:50:20 2020
    I carry a picture of my right hand in my wallet.

    I have to hide it from the left hand; there are some serious jealousy issues.

    Lol. "The Stranger" hahaha

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A44 2020/02/04 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: monterey bbs (21:1/168)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Sat Feb 22 20:30:00 2020
    On 02-21-20 08:44, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    My biggest mistake (a long time ago) was using a CNAME on the naked domain ...
    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?

    Turn away...unless you are ready for something no one should see. ;)

    Can I point and giggle? :P

    Am in a decent mood right now...so I had to take it. ;)

    Haha, now there's a whole book of lines there for the taking! :D


    ... Crime doesn't pay... does that mean my job is a crime?
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Oli on Sat Feb 22 20:39:00 2020
    On 02-21-20 18:15, Oli wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    21 Feb 20 19:43, you wrote to me:

    On 02-20-20 08:39, Oli wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    My biggest mistake (a long time ago) was using a CNAME on the naked
    domain ...

    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?

    something like

    example.com CNAME example.gitlab.io

    A good explanation why this doesn't work: https://www.isc.org/blogs/cname-at-the-apex-of-a-zone/

    Yeah, I've never been silly enough to try that. ;) I use A and AAAA records for the root of vkradio.com. Years ago, that used to break a Windows domain that I was running, but that domain is long gone, and there's no issue. Email has its own MX records pointing to the correct servers for incoming email.


    ... !Who! wal!ked acc!ross this ta!glin!e wit!h muddy fee!t!!
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Feb 22 20:49:00 2020
    On 02-21-20 07:07, poindexter FORTRAN wrote to tenser <=-

    tenser wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I remember that book. For that matter, I remember
    BIND version 4. Ah, the halcyon days of my youth....
    Things were so much simpler then.

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP
    servers as a courtesy.

    I remember the last days of that, but spam quickly ended that practice. :/


    ... People forget how fast you did a job just how well you did it.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Sat Feb 22 20:50:00 2020
    On 02-22-20 06:14, Avon wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    On 21 Feb 2020 at 07:07a, poindexter FORTRAN pondered and said...

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP servers as a courtesy.

    I hope the date goes well... oh wait a minute :)

    Haha. :D

    Joking aside I think it's neat that we have such a nice mix of age and experience with respect to the early and later Internet eras along with those of us old enough to remember dial up times, the hey day of BBS
    and earlier still.

    I always enjoy your thoughtful posts. Thanks for writing/sharing them
    :)

    Yes, it's a good mix of people in here. :)


    ... Dancing: A perpendicular expression of a horizontal desire.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to ryan on Sat Feb 22 20:51:00 2020
    On 02-21-20 13:41, ryan wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I'm dating myself here, but I remember when people ran open SMTP servers as a courtesy.

    I'm pretty fussy and don't think I could put up with dating myself,
    which is why I just have a series of one night stands with myself

    Oh dear, bad visuals. :P


    ... Never park your hard disk in a tow-away zone.
    === MultiMail/Win v0.51
    --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
    * Origin: Freeway BBS Bendigo,Australia freeway.apana.org.au (21:1/109)
  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Sat Feb 22 03:57:32 2020
    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?
    Turn away...unless you are ready for something no one should see. ;)
    Can I point and giggle? :P

    One good thing...I have the electron magnifying glass racket for you to have something to point to & giggle.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Sun Feb 23 00:01:00 2020
    On 02-21-20 22:57, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?
    Turn away...unless you are ready for something no one should see. ;)
    Can I point and giggle? :P

    One good thing...I have the electron magnifying glass racket for you to have something to point to & giggle.

    Haha small targets? ;)


    ... Some people are just for looks.
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Avon on Sat Feb 22 12:44:00 2020
    Avon wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    Joking aside I think it's neat that we have such a nice mix of age and experience with respect to the early and later Internet eras along with those of us old enough to remember dial up times, the hey day of BBS
    and earlier still.

    WHO ARE YOU CALLING OLD????

    <ducks, runs>




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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to ryan on Sat Feb 22 12:45:00 2020
    ryan wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    I'm pretty fussy and don't think I could put up with dating myself,
    which is why I just have a series of one night stands with myself

    I have so much in common.


    ... Do you have access to your previous configuration?
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Atreyu on Sat Feb 22 13:26:00 2020
    Atreyu wrote to Ryan <=-
    I carry a picture of my right hand in my wallet.

    I have to hide it from the left hand; there are some serious jealousy issues.

    Have you asked about a threesome?

    ... At the end of the day, it gets dark.
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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to tenser on Mon Feb 24 00:28:09 2020
    On 23 Feb 2020 at 03:34p, tenser pondered and said...

    I've spent a fair amount of time with a bunch of
    FTSC documents lately as I wrote my own binkp
    implementation and am writing my own FTN<->NNTP
    gateway software (binkd was too buggy and the
    upstream maintainer isn't terribly responsive;
    existing FTN<->NNTP gateways have bit rotted and

    I was trying to send you some of that 'older' software / code earlier today
    but the email was rejected I think because I attached .zip files to it. I'll drop the stuff in your filebox and just resend the email without attachments.

    I'd certainly be interested in testing anything you created for FTN<>NNTP
    down the track if you want help.

    latency). Anyway, I think there's significant
    room for improvement and innovation. It sounds
    fun. It sounds experimental. It might be
    much simpler in terms of implementation than
    what's out there now.

    I'm open to trying new ideas.. I guess the key is to have people with the software skills to implement things and in a way that enables as much compatibility as possible.

    I have not followed the thread closely but my take outs were create a FTN
    style nodelist from a zone file rather than the other way around. That
    there's ways of encoding all the current FTN nodelist 'stuff' into a zone
    file at present. I'm picking there's always ways to improve or add things to enhance the status quo also :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
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  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Sat Feb 22 13:42:45 2020
    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?
    Turn away...unless you are ready for something no one should see
    Can I point and giggle? :P
    One good thing...I have the electron magnifying glass racket for you have something to point to & giggle.
    Haha small targets? ;)

    Always been true...nuke 'em till they glow & shoot 'em in the dark.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: ACME BBS-I taut I taw a puddy tat! (21:2/147)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Tue Feb 25 01:28:00 2020
    On 02-22-20 08:42, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Hmm, what do you mean by that exactly?
    Turn away...unless you are ready for something no one should see
    Can I point and giggle? :P
    One good thing...I have the electron magnifying glass racket for you have something to point to & giggle.
    Haha small targets? ;)

    Always been true...nuke 'em till they glow & shoot 'em in the dark.

    Hahaha ouch. :D


    ... I am Homer of Borg! Prepare to be ... Oooooo! Donuts!
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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Oli on Tue Feb 25 14:10:02 2020
    On 24 Feb 2020 at 05:16p, Oli pondered and said...

    But the cool thing about FTN is that it just needs a plaintext file to connect nodes. No domain registrations that cost money and make some people rich. DNS is already a good target for censorship and stuff is happening that is outside the control of the user (sysop).

    Yes, the decentralization thing is interesting, but there might be better solutions nowadays (distributed hash table, ...). I'm more interested in getting rid of the DNS dependency in FTN.

    This also sounds like a cool idea to explore.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)
  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Mon Feb 24 21:20:44 2020
    Always been true...nuke 'em till they glow & shoot 'em in the dark.
    Hahaha ouch. :D

    The only bad thing is if we can make them glow red...rather than blue...we
    will have an easier time finding them.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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    * Origin: ACME BBS-I taut I taw a puddy tat! (21:2/147)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Tue Feb 25 17:21:00 2020
    On 02-24-20 16:20, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Always been true...nuke 'em till they glow & shoot 'em in the dark.
    Hahaha ouch. :D

    The only bad thing is if we can make them glow red...rather than
    blue...we will have an easier time finding them.


    Haha OK. :)


    ... "Mount your horses, men!!" "We're not that lonely, sir!!"
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  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Tue Feb 25 01:19:32 2020
    The only bad thing is if we can make them glow red...rather than blue...we will have an easier time finding them.
    Haha OK. :)

    Now...if we can teach them to ride the storm like Slim Pickens from Dr. Strangelove...be a real money maker.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to alter ego on Wed Feb 26 02:00:37 2020

    On 25 Feb 2020 at 05:40p, alter ego pondered and said...

    I believe that is my queue to say something ...

    "Something" :)

    Can we quote you on that :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
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  • From Joacim Melin@21:2/130 to Avon on Tue Feb 25 16:57:17 2020
    (I'm not gonna quote the entire message chain here but bare with me...)

    One of the things I learnt while (foolishly, since it's like pouring gazoline on a fire trying to put out the fire) trying to help Ward move, update and take
    control over fidonet.org and it's website is this: hacks like updating DNS zonefiles from nodelists or vice-versa are nice as long as anyone is interested
    in maintaining the whole thing. In the case of fidonet.org someone (I can't remember who) hosted the site and setup everything many many years ago and now,
    when Ward came knocking, was happy to have someone else take it off his hands but at the same time wasn't that interested in explaining how stuff was setup.

    What I'm trying to say is this: if possible, don't mess with a working system.
    Nodelists work, let's keep it that way.


    --- NiKom v2.5.0
    * Origin: Delta City (deltacity.se, Vallentuna, Sweden) (21:2/130.0)
  • From Joacim Melin@21:2/130 to Joacim Melin on Tue Feb 25 17:50:28 2020
    (I'm not gonna quote the entire message chain here but bare with
    me...)

    One of the things I learnt while (foolishly, since it's like pouring gazoline on a fire trying to put out the fire) trying to help Ward
    move, update and take control over fidonet.org and it's website is
    this: hacks like updating DNS zonefiles from nodelists or vice-versa
    are nice as long as anyone is interested in maintaining the whole
    thing. In the case of fidonet.org someone (I can't remember who)
    hosted the site and setup everything many many years ago and now,
    when Ward came knocking, was happy to have someone else take it off
    his hands but at the same time wasn't that interested in explaining
    how stuff was setup.

    What I'm trying to say is this: if possible, don't mess with a
    working system. Nodelists work, let's keep it that way.

    I just wanted to add something to what I wrote above: I'm all for technical advancements, trying new things and whatnot. I'm all for trying to enhance FSXNet but I've seen enough of these good ideas go to waste when people loose interest and move on, leaving the ones who remain a bit stranded when things break.

    Just so I'm being clear: I'm not discouraging any kind of new stuff, as long as
    the old stuff still works as a fallback should things go south.


    --- NiKom v2.5.0
    * Origin: Delta City (deltacity.se, Vallentuna, Sweden) (21:2/130.0)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Wed Feb 26 13:51:00 2020
    On 02-24-20 20:19, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    The only bad thing is if we can make them glow red...rather than blue...we will have an easier time finding them.
    Haha OK. :)

    Now...if we can teach them to ride the storm like Slim Pickens from Dr. Strangelove...be a real money maker.

    Since I haven't seen that, the reference is lost on me. :P


    ... My toys! My toys! I can't do this job without my toys!
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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Joacim Melin on Wed Feb 26 14:21:00 2020
    On 02-25-20 12:50, Joacim Melin wrote to Joacim Melin <=-

    Just so I'm being clear: I'm not discouraging any kind of new stuff, as long as
    the old stuff still works as a fallback should things go south.

    You have no argument from me on that one. What I don't want to see is we stick to the old stuff because "It's always been done that way", but having the old ways of doing things as a fallback is very sensible.


    ... Bacon didn't write Shakespeare; Shakespeare ate bacon!
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  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Tue Feb 25 22:18:27 2020
    Now...if we can teach them to ride the storm like Slim Pickens from D Strangelove...be a real money maker.
    Since I haven't seen that, the reference is lost on me. :P

    It's a classic done by Stanley Kubric. Has George C Scott...Peter Sellers
    doing 3 roles. Even has James Earl Jones in I believe his 1st role. Hell of a movie & more scary in times like these.

    There's a conference room they built for the movie that the US military
    called them to ask about the plans of it. You will love it...but remember it takes place in the early '60's.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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    * Origin: ACME BBS-I taut I taw a puddy tat! (21:2/147)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Thu Feb 27 00:31:00 2020
    On 02-25-20 17:18, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Now...if we can teach them to ride the storm like Slim Pickens from D Strangelove...be a real money maker.
    Since I haven't seen that, the reference is lost on me. :P

    It's a classic done by Stanley Kubric. Has George C Scott...Peter
    Sellers doing 3 roles. Even has James Earl Jones in I believe his 1st role. Hell of a movie & more scary in times like these.

    There's a conference room they built for the movie that the US military called them to ask about the plans of it. You will love it...but
    remember it takes place in the early '60's.

    Cool, sounds like one to watch.


    ... Why do we say something is out of whack? What is a whack?
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  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Vk3jed on Wed Feb 26 19:50:22 2020
    Strangelove...be a real money maker.
    It's a classic done by Stanley Kubric. Has George C Scott...Peter Sellers doing 3 roles. Even has James Earl Jones in I believe his 1st role. Hell of a movie & more scary in times like these.
    Cool, sounds like one to watch.

    Be prepared for an escalating situation which goes more crazy the movie goes. The one about the race for caves/mines is one which had me rolling...but when you remember this is the way things work out.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Phoobar on Thu Feb 27 19:22:00 2020
    On 02-26-20 14:50, Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Be prepared for an escalating situation which goes more crazy the movie goes. The one about the race for caves/mines is one which had me rolling...but when you remember this is the way things work out.

    Fair enough. :)


    ... A woman drove me to drink, and I never had the courtesy to thank her.
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@21:4/122 to Phoobar on Fri Feb 28 03:00:00 2020
    Phoobar wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Be prepared for an escalating situation which goes more crazy the movie goes. The one about the race for caves/mines is one which had me rolling...but when you remember this is the way things work out.

    Mein Fuhrer! I can walk!

    (mushroom cloud)


    ... Eval Day 1005
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  • From Joacim Melin@21:2/130 to Phoobar on Sat Feb 29 03:28:25 2020
    Now...if we can teach them to ride the storm like Slim Pickens from
    D
    Strangelove...be a real money maker.
    Since I haven't seen that, the reference is lost on me. :P

    It's a classic done by Stanley Kubric. Has George C Scott...Peter
    Sellers
    doing 3 roles. Even has James Earl Jones in I believe his 1st role.
    Hell of a
    movie & more scary in times like these.

    There's a conference room they built for the movie that the US
    military
    called them to ask about the plans of it. You will love it...but
    remember it
    takes place in the early '60's.

    When Reagan took office in the 80s, one of the first things he demanded was to be shown the War Room. He thought it was all true since he saw it in Dr Strangelove.


    --- NiKom v2.5.0
    * Origin: Delta City (deltacity.se, Vallentuna, Sweden) (21:2/130.0)
  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Feb 29 05:11:01 2020
    Mein Fuhrer! I can walk!
    (mushroom cloud)

    Or this one...Of course, the whole point of a Doomsday Machine is lost, if
    you *keep* it a *secret*! Why didn't you tell the world, EH?

    It was to be announced at the Party Congress on Monday. As you know, the Premier loves surprises.

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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  • From Phoobar@21:2/147 to Joacim Melin on Sat Feb 29 05:14:21 2020
    When Reagan took office in the 80s, one of the first things he demanded was to be shown the War Room. He thought it was all true since he saw it in Dr Strangelove.

    Oh yeah! Heard the government called the producers to get the plans to build one in real life. Instead...you have this...Sir, you can't let him in here. He'll see everything. He'll see the big board! ;)

    ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

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