• Stuff #2

    From Avon@21:1/101 to All on Wed May 6 23:42:30 2020
    I have not read all the posts from the last day or so. I hope to in the
    coming days but honestly life and work at the moment on the home front is
    very busy and stressful too so by evening I am exhausted.

    I'd like to ask those who are posting political stuff to dial it back please. It seems to me politics and religion are two areas that easily can end up in
    an animated discourse, at times not a pleasant or considerate one etc. etc..

    So please let's drop those subjects in fsxNet and stick to other subjects we can all agree and enjoy.

    I am not keen on the idea of creating a politics specific echo.

    I have been heartened to read some more recent exchanges between adults who have been able to exchange views in a polite and measured way, agreeing to disagree and moving on to other subjects. Thanks to those of you who have
    done so.

    I currently lean towards putting something in the goals / housekeeping text that formalizes the leave the politics / religion threads at the door..

    I'm going to have a shower and get some sleep.

    Stay safe, stay well.

    Right now I'm just so totally gutted for Andrew :(

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  • From Oli@21:3/102 to Avon on Thu May 7 14:45:10 2020
    Avon wrote (2020-05-06):

    I have not read all the posts from the last day or so. I hope to in the coming days but honestly life and work at the moment on the home front is very busy and stressful too so by evening I am exhausted.

    I'd like to ask those who are posting political stuff to dial it back please. It seems to me politics and religion are two areas that easily
    can end up in an animated discourse, at times not a pleasant or
    considerate one etc. etc..

    So please let's drop those subjects in fsxNet and stick to other subjects we can all agree and enjoy.

    congratulations to the trump-lovers. that is exactly what they wanted to achieve. suppress criticism and any normal political discussion.

    now everything that is just a little bit political and does not conform to their view will be scrutinized.

    i guess that is worse than fight-o-net. have fun!

    p.s.: i had a backlog of nearly 300 mails in fsx_gen and wrote several mails before i read that fsxnet is now apolitical.

    ---
    * Origin: (21:3/102)
  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Oli on Fri May 8 00:53:30 2020
    On 07 May 2020 at 10:45a, Oli pondered and said...

    congratulations to the trump-lovers. that is exactly what they wanted to achieve. suppress criticism and any normal political discussion.

    You're welcome to take your combative political discussions to othernets that want it.. but please drop posting such content in fsxNet. Cheers.


    p.s.: i had a backlog of nearly 300 mails in fsx_gen and wrote several mails before i read that fsxnet is now apolitical.

    To be clear I'm sure we've all got political views we hold and could share.
    I asking we / you don't as all it's doing is inciting discord and that's not wanted by anyone expect those who enjoy a good argument. Those kinds of arguments I am happy to see elsewhere and not in fsxNet.

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Fri May 8 00:05:00 2020
    On 05-06-20 19:42, Avon wrote to All <=-

    I have been heartened to read some more recent exchanges between adults who have been able to exchange views in a polite and measured way, agreeing to disagree and moving on to other subjects. Thanks to those
    of you who have done so.

    I think thing are settling down a bit. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Oli on Fri May 8 00:38:00 2020
    On 05-07-20 10:45, Oli wrote to Avon <=-

    congratulations to the trump-lovers. that is exactly what they wanted
    to achieve. suppress criticism and any normal political discussion.

    Arrrgh, please knock it off. Avon did ask nicely.


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  • From Oli@21:3/102 to Avon on Thu May 7 16:03:35 2020
    Avon wrote (2020-05-07):

    On 07 May 2020 at 10:45a, Oli pondered and said...

    congratulations to the trump-lovers. that is exactly what they
    wanted to achieve. suppress criticism and any normal political
    discussion.

    You're welcome to take your combative political discussions to othernets that want it.. but please drop posting such content in fsxNet. Cheers.

    long before i started to be "combative" this bullshit went on for month and month. in fact since i joined fsxnet. nobody did anything about it. yes, at some point people are frustrated and cannot take it anymore. i don't want to defend the "go fuck yourself" comment. of course there are better ways to engage in a discussion.

    but with your decision you are supporting people who are doing real harm and confirm their behavior. i'm not sure you followed all of the political threads in fsx_gen.

    p.s.: i had a backlog of nearly 300 mails in fsx_gen and wrote
    several mails before i read that fsxnet is now apolitical.

    To be clear I'm sure we've all got political views we hold and could
    share. I asking we / you don't as all it's doing is inciting discord and that's not wanted by anyone expect those who enjoy a good argument. Those kinds of arguments I am happy to see elsewhere and not in fsxNet.

    i'm confused. you wrote:

    So please let's drop those subjects in fsxNet and stick to other
    subjects we can all agree and enjoy.

    talking about stuff and then have to avoid any potentially political stuff that
    could incite discord is very weird. i mean we can talk only about BBSing and TV
    shows. but the moment we talk about covid-19 it is "political" again.

    maybe i'm misunderstanding the meaning of your words.

    i think the rules were good enough, but many people didn't respect them and moderation does not work in fsxnet (which doesn't mean that i expect from you to be a full time moderator).

    having some vague don't-talk-about-inciting-political-stuff policy feels a bit dystopian, especially if it encourages people to pursue their scary right-wing agenda (and i'm not talking about conservatives in general).

    i guess this post is also too political. so i'm indeed moving along.

    ---
    * Origin: (21:3/102)
  • From Oli@21:3/102 to Vk3jed on Thu May 7 17:39:54 2020
    Vk3jed wrote (2020-05-07):

    On 05-07-20 10:45, Oli wrote to Avon <=-

    congratulations to the trump-lovers. that is exactly what they
    wanted to achieve. suppress criticism and any normal political
    discussion.

    Arrrgh, please knock it off. Avon did ask nicely.

    sorry, i mean that seriously. it's not about picking a fight. i'm out of fsx_gen.

    ---
    * Origin: (21:3/102)
  • From Jeff@21:1/180 to Avon on Wed May 6 11:49:23 2020
    On 06 May 2020, Avon said the following...
    please. It seems to me politics and religion are two areas that easily
    can end up in an animated discourse, at times not a pleasant or considerate one etc. etc..

    The saying "never discuss politics or religion in polite company" well
    predates the current political climate.

    Jeff.

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  • From Jeff@21:1/180 to Oli on Thu May 7 11:49:57 2020
    On 07 May 2020, Oli said the following...
    talking about stuff and then have to avoid any potentially political
    stuff that could incite discord is very weird. i mean we can talk only about BBSing and TV shows. but the moment we talk about covid-19 it is "political" again.

    Oli's got a point. Perhaps it's not clear to others just how divided the US
    is. Things that are not political elsewhere, and things that were previously not political in the US, are very political now.

    Due to numerous theories on the origin of COVID-19, and various opinions on
    how well it was, and is being, handled in the US, even a virus is now a political topic. So are any discussions of how to address it, including lockdowns, re-openings, and even vaccines. Bill Gates is even getting dragged into it. It's amazing, really.

    Jeff.

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  • From mastermind@21:1/101 to Avon on Fri May 8 07:00:59 2020
    I'd like to ask those who are posting political stuff to dial it back please. It seems to me politics and religion are two areas that easily
    can end up in an animated discourse, at times not a pleasant or considerate one etc. etc..

    I feel that its a part of fsxNet that I liked... however, OK & done.

    I didn't see the posts about what happened with apam; but he is one of the members of fsxNet that is highly regarded IMO.

    You won't see another political post by me.

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  • From Spectre@21:3/101 to Jeff on Fri May 8 05:43:00 2020
    The saying "never discuss politics or religion in polite company" well predates the current political climate.

    Have't heard that in so long I'd forgotten it. Trouble with both of those ìthings is there are as many points of view as there are people alive and ìlittle to no concensus to any of it :)

    Spec


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  • From Al@21:4/106 to Oli on Thu May 7 14:16:00 2020
    Hello Oli,

    i guess this post is also too political. so i'm indeed moving along.

    It is so hard to, probably impossible to have discussions/conversations around anything at all and avoid something political in there somewhere/somehow.

    I don't talk politics a lot in real life because it doesn't come up in the circles I travel I guess.

    I don't mind politics if people could discuss it like adults and realize that everyone in a little (or a lot) left or right of center and that is not a bad thing.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

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  • From Rick Smith@21:1/190.1 to Al on Thu May 7 14:54:57 2020
    //Hello Al, //

    On *07.05.20* To *10:16:00* you wrote in the Area *FSX_GEN*
    To *Oli* About *"Stuff #2"*.

    Hello Oli,

    i guess this post is also too political. so i'm indeed moving along.

    I don't mind politics if people could discuss it like adults and realize that everyone in a little (or a lot) left or right of center and that is not a bad thing.

    I agree everyone is different, I think most of the problem lies with that people are too sensitive about their own positions so listening or talking to someone respectfully that do not share their positions, becomes well frankly impossible. A lot of it may be due to the stress that everyone is currently under, who knows?


    Regards ...
    Rick Smith

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Oli on Fri May 8 16:53:00 2020
    On 05-07-20 13:39, Oli wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Arrrgh, please knock it off. Avon did ask nicely.

    sorry, i mean that seriously. it's not about picking a fight. i'm out
    of fsx_gen.

    And therein lies the reason we don't want political discussion in here, it doesn't make a positive contribution. People taking their bat and ball and going home isn't what we want either. :/


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Al on Sat May 9 02:00:00 2020
    On 05-07-20 10:16, Al wrote to Oli <=-

    I don't mind politics if people could discuss it like adults and
    realize that everyone in a little (or a lot) left or right of center
    and that is not a bad thing.

    I'm the same - I can and often do talk politics (generally our domestic politics) with people I know. Right now, it's actually a relatively benign subject in Australia, because currently, the parties are in broad agreement with what needs to be done and different only in detail, which can be interedting and constructive to discuss (but I won't have that discussion here ;) ).


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  • From Alpha@21:4/158 to Vk3jed on Fri May 8 12:12:26 2020
    I'm the same - I can and often do talk politics (generally our domestic politics) with people I know. Right now, it's actually a relatively benign subject in Australia, because currently, the parties are in broad agreement with what needs to be done and different only in detail, which can be interedting and constructive to discuss (but I won't have that discussion here ;) ).

    I think this is the kind of political discussion that is actually healthy.
    It's not about brow-beating a political message, it's about shared empathy, cultural understanding, personal experience -- *and* you just taught me something I didn't know about your POV in Australia :)

    I live in Berkeley, CA--literally the most politically progressive
    (left, liberal, etc.) city in the US--so the conversations with people I know tend to be 'centrist democrat vs more progressive' ideologies (not
    the traditional 'left vs right' US arguments). Its probably like that in
    other parts of the US on any side of the spectrum. Which isn't *always* a
    good thing, regional bubbles and all, but most people I know reject the weird stuff and conspiracy theories and tend to have civil discourse.

    If this crosses the no-politics conversation, please let me know and I'll zip it :)


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  • From Spectre@21:3/101 to Vk3jed on Sat May 9 11:57:00 2020
    And therein lies the reason we don't want political discussion in here, it doesn't make a positive contribution. People taking their bat and ball and going home isn't what we want either. :/

    Political atheists only. :P


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  • From Spectre@21:3/101 to Vk3jed on Sat May 9 12:03:00 2020
    benign subject in Australia, because currently, the parties are in
    broad agreement with what needs to be done and different only in
    detail, which can be interedting and constructive to discuss (but

    Gah interesting? Its worse than melting blanc mange.. Its like asking if an ìleccy toaster is better than a grill for your toast. :/ They all do the same ìthing. :P

    Spec


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    * Origin: Scrawled in haste at The Lower Planes (21:3/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Alpha on Sat May 9 13:59:00 2020
    On 05-08-20 08:12, Alpha wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I think this is the kind of political discussion that is actually
    healthy. It's not about brow-beating a political message, it's about shared empathy, cultural understanding, personal experience -- *and*
    you just taught me something I didn't know about your POV in Australia
    :)

    Glad to help, and yes, these sort of exploratory, educating discussions are helpful. And I'm one who will judge a government on its merit (through its actions), not its political affiliations. The corrent Federal government is an example. I'm not a Libera;/National coalition voter, but they are currently in power at Federal level. Abd throughout the COVID-19 crisis, their performance has been reasonably good for the most part. And any bad parts are often details that I've seen parties of any persuasion get wrong - so easy to do when having to respond to a rapidly evolving crisis - politicians are only human, afterall. :)

    So despite idological differences, I still have respect and support for the government's handling of COVID-19 for the most part. They've focused on the wellbeing of the country, buth health and economically.

    I live in Berkeley, CA--literally the most politically progressive
    (left, liberal, etc.) city in the US--so the conversations with people
    I know tend to be 'centrist democrat vs more progressive' ideologies
    (not the traditional 'left vs right' US arguments). Its probably like
    that in other parts of the US on any side of the spectrum. Which isn't *always* a good thing, regional bubbles and all, but most people I know reject the weird stuff and conspiracy theories and tend to have civil discourse.

    If this crosses the no-politics conversation, please let me know and
    I'll zip it :)

    Well, it was a thoughtful post of discussion.

    I'm left of centre (but not strongly so) and socially liberal. That's more a function of my life experiences than anything else. I'm someone who recognises and relies on the INTERdependence of people in a functional society. COVID-19 has also brought that out, as restrictions have disrupted supply chains around the world. Incidentally, my parents were coalition (i.e. conservative) voters when I was a teenager - basically the mirror image of my position, so one can't blame parental influences. :)

    What it all means for the future is too early to tell.


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Spectre on Sat May 9 15:20:00 2020
    On 05-09-20 07:57, Spectre wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    And therein lies the reason we don't want political discussion in here, it doesn't make a positive contribution. People taking their bat and ball and going home isn't what we want either. :/

    Political atheists only. :P

    We're undecided about agnostics. :D


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Spectre on Sat May 9 15:21:00 2020
    On 05-09-20 08:03, Spectre wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Gah interesting? Its worse than melting blanc mange.. Its like asking
    if an leccy toaster is better than a grill for your toast. :/ They all
    do the same thing. :P

    Haha, we least we're not calling each other names. :D


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  • From Spectre@21:3/101 to Vk3jed on Sat May 9 18:57:00 2020
    :/ They all do the same thing. :P

    Haha, we least we're not calling each other names. :D

    There is that :)_

    ████
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    --- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Spectre on Sat May 9 21:34:00 2020
    On 05-09-20 14:57, Spectre wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    :/ They all do the same thing. :P

    Haha, we least we're not calling each other names. :D

    There is that :)_

    Indeed. :)

    ████
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    Your Facebook is showing. ;)


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  • From Blue White@21:4/134 to Vk3jed on Sat May 9 23:16:33 2020
    And therein lies the reason we don't want political discussion in here, it doesn't make a positive contribution. People taking their bat and ball and going home isn't what we want either. :/

    Then again, if they cannot stop themselves from jumping into what is a non-political discussion and going off about (fill in the blank with a politician), while it may not be what we want, it may be what we need in
    order to get back to civil conversation here.


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  • From stizzed@21:4/156 to Spectre on Sat May 9 18:05:44 2020
    ████
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    HAHAHAHA! First page looks alot like 8-bit porn! (or is it just me?)

    .\\ichael Batts
    a.k.a. stizzed (because, why not?)
    SysOp, The ROCK BBS III

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
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  • From Spectre@21:3/101 to Vk3jed on Sun May 10 15:51:00 2020
    Your Facebook is showing. ;)

    Better tuck that back in. Must've been the sling action pulled it out.

    Spec ;)


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  • From Spectre@21:3/101 to stizzed on Sun May 10 21:25:00 2020
    HAHAHAHA! First page looks alot like 8-bit porn! (or is it just

    I s'pose if you tilt your head over a bit... :)

    Spec


    --- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
    * Origin: (21:3/101)
  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Blue White on Sun May 10 22:20:00 2020
    On 05-09-20 19:16, Blue White wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    And therein lies the reason we don't want political discussion in here, it doesn't make a positive contribution. People taking their bat and ball and going home isn't what we want either. :/

    Then again, if they cannot stop themselves from jumping into what is a non-political discussion and going off about (fill in the blank with a politician), while it may not be what we want, it may be what we need
    in order to get back to civil conversation here.

    Good point. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Spectre on Sun May 10 22:35:00 2020
    On 05-10-20 11:51, Spectre wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    Your Facebook is showing. ;)

    Better tuck that back in. Must've been the sling action pulled it out.

    Hahaha, and you were watching. :P


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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Vk3jed on Mon May 11 19:15:09 2020
    On 07 May 2020 at 08:05p, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    I think thing are settling down a bit. :)

    I'm 200+ messages behind at the moment, I'll get back to you :)

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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Jeff on Mon May 11 19:33:46 2020
    On 06 May 2020 at 07:49a, Jeff pondered and said...

    The saying "never discuss politics or religion in polite company" well predates the current political climate.

    Nice saying :)

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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to mastermind on Mon May 11 19:53:23 2020
    On 08 May 2020 at 03:00a, mastermind pondered and said...

    I feel that its a part of fsxNet that I liked... however, OK & done.

    Thanks man... yeah I've been trying to find a happy line for all on all of
    this stuff but it's tough to do so and in the end it seems subjects that
    drift into politics and religion (not that we have seen much of the latter
    here to be fair) can cause some heated and rather unpleasant exchanges
    between some. The vibe from the wider community appears to be 'can we leave those things at the door please'

    I didn't see the posts about what happened with apam; but he is one of
    the members of fsxNet that is highly regarded IMO.

    This could be the news about the health of the unborn kids he and his wife
    are having? It may be older stuff... either way, yeah he's a good guy and has my respect too.


    You won't see another political post by me.

    Thanks

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Mon May 11 20:47:00 2020
    On 05-11-20 15:15, Avon wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    On 07 May 2020 at 08:05p, Vk3jed pondered and said...

    I think thing are settling down a bit. :)

    I'm 200+ messages behind at the moment, I'll get back to you :)

    *sprints away* :P


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